Nice demonstration. But the group here would have....like...ten knives just on their person. LOL!  Great idea and video Howard.

Wait a minute, Clint.  You mean to tell me that guys here who won't even consider batoning their knives through some wood are gonna use their Randall or pristine Queen to open a can?  Perish the thought.

Client, I guess I'm going to have to man up, because I only have five EDCs and a couple of razor blades. The SAK has a can opener, which I have actually used. The crazyrussian is dangerous to watch, because you start watching and the honeydew projects get forgotten.

Howard, I know your comment was tongue in check, but let's see; life or knife? Hmmmm?

James,

Hahahahaha.  Yep, tongue in cheek.  Life or knife?  Life's gonna win that one.

LOL   My EDC is two Rough Riders, a $7 one and a $14 one.  So no question whatsoever with me!

Howard, Maybe I should have kept my keyboard in "check"; I hate it when I mispel a word.

"Trapped and facing certain death, Ralston chose a final option that later made him an international sensation: Using a multitool, the climber amputated his right hand, then rappelled to freedom."  Aron Ralston in National Geographic Magazine

Charles, I think that shows us that we will sacrifice much more than a knife to survive.

You are definitely right there James!

ok well the concrete works LOL

Dont tell Tony but if I was that hungry and it was life and death...I would use a darn Bose to open it

Howard I carry in my pocket the very P-38 my Uncle Mike gave me in 1951.  I have used it many times. I have also used a pocket knife or fix blade to open a tin of beans. On long stakeouts I would have in supply of beans and lots of water. I would poke a hole in the top of the can and remover the label. I would then place the can upright on the hot car manifold and heat my beans. The same works by placing in some hot coals.

After the beans were hot I would open the can with my knife. A good sized knife will not be damaged by this process.

However, we all know we are the bunch who is prepared and will have our Leatherman Wave...or the like...to do the camp site duties.

Clint,

For its size, the P-38 can opener has amazing utility.  The P-51 being a bit larger has better mechanical advantage.  These can openers are still being produced, both here and off shore so anybody can get them.  I think they are essential, and folks should pack one everywhere, as well as wear one around their necks.

P-38 with penny for size comparison:

P-38 & P-51:

While on the topic of can openers, I wanted to mention what I call a punch can opener.  These things were around forever, and while we weren't looking, they disappeared from the shelves of stores.  I live in PA and have not seen one in years, but maybe down south somewhere there are a few in some old hardware store, but good luck finding one.  These openers would puncture a hole and then by moving the handle back and forth, would open the can.

Here's a pic of the last iteration of the punch can opener.  Ecko made em.  Could only find a rusty image:

Here's a vintage one I picked up in an antique shop a couple years ago:

Howard, I don't want to start an argument but the can openers you are showing were first patented in 1855.  While they have been around for close to 150 years  the tin can out dates them by about 80 years.  Still, this is the earliest device designed specifically for opening cans!  Before then, people opened them open with whatever they had that was sharp, including spike bayonets.

Robert Yeates is credited with coming up with the first practical "lever can opener in Middlesex, England in 1855.  Three years later, Ezra Warner of Waterbury, Conneticutt a similar lever can opener.   These can openers became immensely popular during the American  Civil War.

Howard,

I grew up thinking the P38 was something that came with your car.  After all everyone I knew had one in the glove box.  Guess that comes from having a military family LOL.

The punch...thats the tool in the tackle box and yes we still have a few hanging around.  Honestly the P38 is easier for me to use

The P-38 is a thing of perfection.

Tobias,

No arguments here.  I knew the punch opener was old.  We used them to open evaporated milk cans - just the punch.  It just surprised me that they would "suddenly" disappear.  I mean, Ecko was making them in the modern era.  Some years ago I decided I wanted one for my toolbox, but they were gone, and given the younger staff at hardware stores I got blank stares when I explained what this can opener looked like.

Tobias, I am going to ask maybe a dumb question.  Two of our WWII fighter planes were also called P38 and P51.  Was there any connection between the can openers and the planes having the same designation or was it pure coincidence?

I have both P38s and P51s coming out of my ears.  In cars, backpacks, brief cases, and altoid tins.  I prefer the P5, it's easier to handle.

The old style opener can be found at Amazon: search for "Old Fashioned Can and Bottle Opener"

I became a hero this last summer by using the concrete trick.  We were camping with some cub scouts and realized that nobody brought an opener for the beans.  I found a reasonably flat rock and rubbed on there to open it up.  I was getting a lot of strange looks while I was doing it, and the other leaders were still looking around for the opener not believing that my "trick" was going to work.  When I stood up with an open can it became an instant class that I was teaching to the boys on how to improvise.

When I've done this in the past, I usually rub the can until I start to see the juices come out onto the rock or concrete, then flip it over and squeeze or stick a knife/fork/screwdriver down into the gap and pop the top up.

It takes a little while, but it works in a pinch.  I don't open enough cans to make it worthwhile to carry around an opener.

Get paid to eat MRE's

LOL, this seems like something we would have done in college

A review from a guy that thought it would not be useful

Hi all!  I am not a Survivalist, but am very interested in it.  I have M.S. and am disabled.  If you want me to leave the room I understand and will do so.

Oh man, I hope that there aren't requirements to be here.  I'm a survivalist only in the sense that I haven't yet died despite daily warnings from my wife that she's going to kill me one of these days. :)

I believe I can speak for this group. Everyone is welcome and appreciated. We all are survivalists in one way or the other.

John and Cory,

You two made me laugh...all husbands are survivors (ok at least I know mine is).  My grandfather had MS and anyone that can make it through, day by day, qualifies as a survivor to me.

Clint,

Thanks, you are soooo right!

We are all survivors in some way. I have been learning some of the survival skills of the wild recently. It is fun and challenging for me. I know that all are welcome. Glad you have you all here. Starting a fire in challenging conditions, is one of my interests that I am working on currently.

John, I for one want to say "Welcome" and you don't need anyone's permission (well maybe Jan's) to be in any group or add to the conversation.

Cory,

My wife says the same things, only she adds "remember, I am faster than you".

Thanks all!  I look forward to learning.

Jeremy, years ago we used to take our kids camping.  We had a travel trailer.  I used a hand held propane torch to start fires.  Worked in the rain too :-)

Hi John,

Actually I would like to hear some insights from people who suffer from various types of physical or mental disabilities and what their survival plans are.  Many of us face challenges that will make surviving  periods of civil unrest ora natural disaster a bigger challenge  for us than the Bear Grylls of the world.

I assume that if you're on this group you're interested in more than what bushcraft knife are you going to use when you get dropped of in the Amazon Jungle with a film crew.  The media has a tend to lump survivalists into folks who are prepping for zombie apocalypse.   I try to focus, on how to make it through likely natural disaster or short periods of civil unrest.

For me, The natural disasters  are tornadoes, flash floods and blizzards.   As for civil unrest, I live in  Chicago, so that means keeping current with the news,  avoiding potential protest areas, and staying alert when on public transportation.

I'm still not overly impressed with the credit card axe.   It is a very soft steel (I believe it is 316 Stainless)   316 is used in one time use surgical scalpels.   It is going to dull quickly as it is relatively soft.    I can cut through that tree branch just as quickly and with less energy expended using the saw on my 111mm Swiss Army Knife.

I think if anything, this would make a more intimidating make-shift personal defense weapon, that is, if the mugger gave you five-ten minutes to put it together.

At the end of the day, I'd rather have my Swiss Army Knife than an credit card axe.

Tobias...

What you are doing is surviving and is the right thing to do. Stay alert, stay informed (Intel) and stay prepared. In Chicago it would be more difficult to have the firearm or firearms needed to defend yourself in your home.

In Oklahoma it is your right to protect yourself, your home and your loved ones with deadly force. It is not only your right but is expected of you. Really different worlds.

Tobias -- Love your walking stick...my 6½' one carries badges from eleven countries on it and there isn't a free space left.

I completely agree with your assessment on the CC Axe...Did you count the number of stroke he took to chop down a 2" tree...My hatchet would take maybe four and my canoe/cruiser axe at most two.

I just can't see a use for it or for that matter why/where I would carry it?  If I'm outdoors then I'm equipped and if I'm stranded in my vehicle again I'm equipped.

Tobias, thanks for your note.  I was diagnosed with M.S. in 1980.  It has been so long now that survival with this disease is 2nd nature.  If something in the discussion comes up I will  comment on it.

My survivalist situation is somewhat unique.  I could bug out to the woods in an emergency but my wife can't.  So I won't, I will not leave her.  So for most any survival emergency my only option is to hunker down at home.  We always keep a goodly supply of bottled water and various types of canned and dry type foods.  Enough to carry both mine and my sons families through several days.

In the event of civil disorder I am probably better prepared than most to deal with it.  I will just say that I am well armed and know how to use them.  I served several years as a reserve police officer and am an experienced hunter.

The one likely situation in which we would bug out is during tornado weather.  We then go one mile to take shelter in our church.  It is not a tornado shelter per se but is a much more substantial concrete and steel building than our home.  We go into a ground floor interior room with no exterior walls.

I do maintain a bug out bag but its contents are a weather radio, a scanner, multiple flashlights, extra batteries, and a multi tool type knife.  I do not keep a gun in it because I will have on me my normal EDC of a .38 and a .380.  As we go out the door I will probably grab my 15 shot 9 mm also.  I will also have my EDC of a small single blade pocket knife, my lockback folding hunter in a belt sheath, and my Leatherman Micra.

We usually have advance notice when storms are possible so I will make sure my wife's wheel chair is in the van and will add my wife's good jewelry and medicine and a little cash we keep on hand for emergencies.to the bug out bag.

Charles, is your Micra a scissors or pliers?  My pliers type was taken by TSA.  I carry a scissors type today.

I, like Tobias, have an interest in how those with challenges plan.  While I am not in a wheel chair I suffer from Post-concussion syndrome.  This means at any given moment I might be sick to my stomach or have a migraine come on.  This on top of 6 herniated discs makes all but the easiest travel darn near impossible.  It also adds the challenge of what I would do without the meds.  In my bug out bag, I keep ginger ( for the nausea ) and about three days worth of the migraine and dizziness pills.  OK, for hunkering down this is not too bad, but I have often wondered if there is not something more I could be doing in case we really do have to bug out?

Jan the one thing we all need is a plan. If this event happens, a preset plan will take place involving all people who will join or rally with you. If another event happens then my group will rally at a point with these tools, weapons and supplies and we will move, fort-up etc. A good written plan with duties supplies and equipment assigned to the participants. This will save the time wasted in trying to call through jammed cell phone signals. By the way, Texting will get through easier. Just text a code word which will get people moving...i.e. "Plan 1".

John, my micra has the scissors.  They cut good and I use them a lot.

We live in an area devoid of natural calamities--no hurricanes, tornadoes, poisonous reptiles or insects, snow or ice storms, far enough away from any river to avoid flooding but we do have extreme cold (can reach -40F/C).  We will hunker down and survive.

The problem with illness isn't the illness itself but the hoard of medication needed to combat it. What happens when you run out?

Two of my neighbours have Type 1 (insulin dependent) diabetic children and they know that they will have about a year with them after the faeces encounters the oscillating aero appliance.  They can't stockpile more then that as the meds deteriorate with time (faster unrefrigerated) and unless they can find a way to manufacture it on their own their children will die. Plain and simple. 

What I love are these deluded preppers who will take their three/four weapons and take to the woods and survive long term on rabbits and squirrels.  Small first aid kit, canteen of water, some energy bars and they'll survive.  Yeah right!  At least Gunkid adhered to the idea of a "tactical wheelbarrow" to carry his stuff.

We have to learn our weaknesses and strengths, improve, via learning, the prior and maintain the latter.

The cost of medications is an issue too. Some Insurance and Medicare will not pay for large amount of drugs. If events seem to be spinning out of control, I would tell my doctor I am heading overseas for six months to be on white beaches to sip on unusual drinks served by scantily clad dressed native young ladies. If he/she buys this then they will give you a scrip for this amount. Now you may have to pay some out of your pocket.

Me...my doctor would believe this as I have gone to some wild places where flying metal is the norm. He has written a scrip like this for me on several occasions.

Survival for me depends on a couple of things: 1) Our modern world continuing (postal deliveries, electricity, hospitals, pharmaceutical companies, drug research, etc.)  If I was born anytime before 1960 (or so) I would be dead.  Bugging out would be impossible to survive.

Fort up in your home John, would be the best thing for you. Just plan to survive any event in your home. Make plans with family, close friends and possibly neighbors who can all come together for mutual support. You can hold the Fort while the support can make the food, meds and water runs.

Since moving to the mountain I have rethought a lot of habits.  In Florida you ran the a/c, period.  Cook, do laundry whatever, the A/C ran.  I find up here I time things to coincide with the weather.  Today it was 20, I cooked a roast slow and in the oven all day.  Tomorrow morning it will be 16 so I will be doing laundry and running the dryer.  These are things that need to be done, why not use them to help the ambient heat....so any other suggestions you all might have?  The wood stove is 90% of our heat source, a small infered heater for the rest

We heat only with wood and only have electrical power supplied by solar panels and a pair of wind turbines (older, small and inefficient).  Back up power by a pair of diesel generators.  Actually, not correct as we have a large bar-b-que that is propane powered--it's just far more convenient than charcoal.  Attached to the kacheloffen is an older wood fired cook stove if the electricity does go out.  We have a number of space heaters but they are used mainly to keep the pipes from freezing.

In summer we hang the laundry from lines and let the free wind dry them instead of heating up the house. We use slow cooking overnight so that we don't heat up the kitchen during the heat of the day.  We use the dishwasher at the same time. 

Granny's house had a wood stove in the center of the kitchen--one side for eating and the other for food prep and cleanup...The stove pipe ran the length of the room and beneath it was a heavy gauge wire from which we hung our wet winter clothes.  It also provided much need heat to that section of the house.  She had an old ringer washer and used lines outdoors or A-frame drying racks indoors.  Her house didn't get plumbing until the early 1960s--hand pump in the kitchen, outhouse and chamber pots. Summer she'd have my brothers move the washer to her porch.

The biggest mistake made with wood stoves is putting them close up against the wall.  The more room behind gives far better circulation.  Also invest in a couple of convection fans that run off the heat from the stove to circulate the warmth.  We hooked up a number of old computer fans at the top of the doorways to move air around to the other rooms--prevents hot spots.

Shlomo,

Yep, in the warmer months I use a clothesline and I grill most anything that gets cooked.  Mostly we dont eat alot of hot food in the summer

The wood stove is in Donnie's shop, there is a duct and vent from there to the top floor and 2 of the convection fans are in that room also

Today I am making dog cookies for the animals on the mountain and that will run the stove for a couple hours.  I ran the dryer at 7am :)