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Permalink Reply by Trent Rock on February 8, 2011 at 13:17

Trent your comment a Buck(underlined) is very interesting to me. Did Buck actually perceive that their customers felt it was important for Buck to be branded fully USA made? Did they consolidate production in US because the profit margin on knives made elsewhere was too low? Could they not control quality? I would love to know if they contracted knife production or in fact had their own "Buck factory".

I know C.J. Buck is on Bladeforums/BUck Knives sub forum
Every couple months some one would post some "alert" type post===>
"Guys...I bought a buck knife at Wal Mart and it says China!!"
Then the whole discussion would begin
So I'm sure Buck Knives was aware of the public perception of Chinese made knives
As to why they decided to bring back production of the lower end knives?
I have no idea
I doubt it was because the profit margins were low

Not sure about the quality control procedure
I don't see why they couldn't have QC in the Chinese factory like everyone else?

Not sure about Buck factory in China
That is a good question
My guess is they just had them imported and there was no Buck factory
Just a guess, though....

BTW....I think the Buck knives were made in Taiwan, not China??
Not 100% sure

Back when I was a kid Made in Taiwan was synomous with JUNK
Now it's China

I did own a Taiwanese Buck fixed blade and it seemed ok to me
I liked the hanging sheath system

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Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on February 8, 2011 at 15:56

Perhaps Buck felt their customers would respond better if they moved production back to the US and perhaps they thought most of their customers were from US. But to be honest, I'm not sure I buy either of those arguments I'm sure Buck customers are worldwide.

And they certainly could have had their own factory and their own quality control. But if I had to take a guess, the expense was simply not worth the return. Its not cheap to set all that up. It is cheap if you subcontract. Now the question is can they still provide "low end knives" for their good customers and to lure new, young customers while maintaining manufacturing at one US based plant. In fact will they continue to provide low end knives at all?

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Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on February 8, 2011 at 16:08

Ivars, a question. What about knives from Germany or Sweden, are any offering"low end(Inexpensive)" knives? And if so where do those come from? What about Boker, that small stockman, China made.

Ivars Duntavs said:

 

I would like to collect only and only USA manufactured knives, but! If I want to buy for example a Case Seahorse, ok in USA the cheapest cost ~90$. I can buy this knife, but! To get this knife to my country, I must pay for shipping + tax 22% for products which ordered from third countries (outside of European Union) and which costs more than 10EUR. That’s why I can buy only cheap china made knives in price till 30$, ok some cheapest Case or Hen & Rooster, Bulldog and some other manufacturer cheapest not in china made knives. I don’t know what must happen to change something. Maybe all collectors must be a members of special collectors club, which have special shipping company, who ship for free only for club members?

I dont know. Something must changes!

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Permalink Reply by Billy Oneale on February 8, 2011 at 21:51

They do have some good prices on their knives. I have about 6 of their knives and I am happy with all of them. These knives will give you a lot of value for your dollar. They also manufacture for some other brand names. The newer Remington bullet series is one of the main knives  I can think of that are made in the Bear & Sons factory.

JW Smith & Sons Custom Knives said:

http://www.bearandsoncutlery.com/index.php?src=gendocs&ref=Abou... it doesn't get more American this.

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In MemoriamPermalink Reply by D ale on February 8, 2011 at 22:15

I've a few Bear .. from the damascus made for CASE back in their roots, to older "BEAR MGC  ..USA..",   to their current stamping.

 

!!! .. I am pleased, happy with,  and proud of every one of them .. !!! 

Reply by JW Smith & Sons Custom Knives:   http://www.bearandsoncutlery.com/index.php?src=gendocs&ref=Abou... it doesn't get more American this.

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Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on February 9, 2011 at 8:59

Could this kind of be a way for case to have some "low end"?

Dale said:

What's up w/ the collaboration between Case & Frost ????

 

 My observations & conjectures ..

 

Frost owns the “rights” to Corelon ..

Frost mkts .. @ std pricing levels .. some select CASE models .. scaled w/  Corelon matl.

Frost mkts .. 8~10 $ range .. a twin to Case’s mini-copperlock .. critical dimensions = same.

 

I believe Case uses Corelon as scale matl.

 

 

??? .. Any Comments .. ???

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Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on February 9, 2011 at 14:15

Thanks for that Ivars, very helpful insight!

Ivars Duntavs said:

US knife manufacturers china low ends offers in EU. Only the price isnt in $, but in EUR.
If I search a US knives in EU than US prices converts in EUR
90$ --> 90 EUR + shipping (cheaper than from USA).
I saw Buck china stockmans in UK e-store. Of course Rough Rider, Marbles, and other manufacturer low end knives.
If we talk about European knives (produces by EU company's) than there is a low end china, Pakistan, Indonesia, and other countrys manufactured knives.
Boker have two brands.
- Magnum by Boker
- Boker Plus
Both brand knives manufactured in China, Pakistan and other countries. Good example is my Trapper (Boker Plus new series) and Magnum Bonsai Sherie Stockman. Both knives are low end. Trapper is a little bit more expensive than Magnum, because Boker plus is more expensive brand. Magnum is cheapest brand. Many Laguiole knife manufacturers made knives in Pakistan and china (low end). We have a problems with US traditional knives. I serch now a cheapest ways to order my favorite knives here in EU. But I see only a low end for normal prices. Too bad :(

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Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on February 9, 2011 at 14:19

11 of 25 on this pattern red bone. Couldn't get the picture of the laser etch on the blade says "Bear Trap".

Brings up a good point though could this be an opportunity for custom makers to fill?

JW Smith & Sons Custom Knives said:

http://www.bearandsoncutlery.com/index.php?src=gendocs&ref=Abou... it doesn't get more American this.

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Permalink Reply by Chopper on February 10, 2011 at 9:11

Emerson vame out with some lower end models a few years back that were not USA Made but he has stoped doing that and those same knives are made here now, Emerson is 100% USA Made. Not all American made knives are expensive, look at Bear And Sons, i've been meaning to pick one up, i hear there pretty good for the money.

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Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on February 10, 2011 at 9:40

Chopper, I can recommend Bear &Sons knives if you go through the earlier posts here I posted a fair(not great) picture of one that I bought a few years ago.  Some of the file work design was done by Josh Basham and it was meant to simulate a bear trap. Pretty clever design and they have since I understand come out with more colors. But I can report sharp blades and good snap and actually a nice little knife. Thanks for the input on Emerson I did not know that. I'll have to see if I can find the date they brought knife operations back to US. I wonder about the reason for doing it and also wonder if the decision by Buck(see Trent's earlier post) influenced them.

hopper said:

Emerson vame out with some lower end models a few years back that were not USA Made but he has stoped doing that and those same knives are made here now, Emerson is 100% USA Made. Not all American made knives are expensive, look at Bear And Sons, i've been meaning to pick one up, i hear there pretty good for the money.

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Permalink Reply by Tom C on February 12, 2011 at 14:23

That are a lot of reasons younger people are not going towards traditional knives.

 

1. Knives in general are not a needed tool as they once were. Disposable cutlery, EZ-open packaging, tougher laws, etc. In reality you could go for days, or more, today without "requiring" a knife. Most kids I meet have never heard of mumblety peg or chicken and knives are banned at most schools and their functions.

 

2. Collectors and lack of interest by general consumers are driving the companies to higher end boutique, i.e. expensive offerings. When I bought my first knife it was a Schrade cost $5.00 and was available at the hardware store. Where are kids now going to pick up their first knife, especially a traditional. $90 GEC...nah. 

 

3. Collectors, manufacturers, clubs and pubs etc of traditional knives do not seem to have any interest in trying to capture the youth market at all. Kids don't want to here about the value and scarcity. They want the history and cool things you can do with it. Why not have whittling demos and contests for youths at show, hands on sharpening lessons, etc. The tactical market is winning big here, when has Case ever done spots on Spike TV like Cold Steel. Where is the product placement in TV and movies like tacticals on NCIS etc.

 

4. My nephew was reading the forums on my account one night with me. He said "They keep lecturing new guys. That's boring, not everyone is an idiot". I see his point. For kids it can be alienating and lose the fun factor, when the focus of the knife is the collect-ability and not the cool useful stuff you can do with it.

 

 

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Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on February 12, 2011 at 15:23

By the way Chris I meant to comment before but I think you are spot on. The low end knives when you could not afford something more expensive suited you. Gradually you became educated about what knives you liked and your interests in a sense matured. What causes me concern and the reason I posted this is because what if knife companies eliminated the "low end" and instead offered more expensive varieties. Where do the first time customers come from? 

BTW I am old and feel like it everyday! lol

Chris Hillier said:

I am neither young nor old, although there are mornings that i certainly feel one way or the other. I only seriously started amassing knives, more expensive ones that is now that i am more financially settled. People may laugh that I dont have a particular brand i collect, i buy what appeals to me. When i started it was the cheaper versions that allowed me to own enough knives, that were cheap enough to use, that allowed me to formulate what works for me and what is hog wash (excuse the reference Hog). You get what you pay for, in most cases. I'm glad that the knife industry is such that it allowed me to make up MY mind. Now i can focus my money where my hand is, not buying flashy ad queens!

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