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how non knife people react when they see a tactical knife
i flip open a griptillian and everyones all scared im gonna rob the store or something does anyone else have stories like this
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Halicon on
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Got my HHH buckeye burl Camillus folder for when the crowds are heavy and you can't use anything of regular size. It's in my photo collection (bad quality pics, I have a brain damage and thus a slight tremble but you can make most details out).
Awesome knife with an even more awesome lockup.
Jeremi Lett, you have to understand that some people can have traumas due to knives, or anything, you never ever know and just because you yourself know you won't try anything. Say an unstable guy spots you using a knife and he gets it in your head that you're after him. That's crap that happens on a daily basis, no reason to pull unneccessary attention to yourself, or don't you remember your CIA 101? ;)
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Permalink Reply by Jeremi Lett on
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Put it this way...I would pull out a 3 inch blade knife for cutting my food in public place,but a 6 in. blade would draw undue attention and scare others.If a person tries to take my knife/tool from my possession, they are causing me to feel that my life is in jeopardy and/or direct threat!Now I will avoid any blood spill or damage,but if the other person threatens my safety,I don't give a damn if it's a nicely dressed business man hopped up on shit,or a f-ing escaped convict/mental case,I can & will defend myself and those around me.Stay aware,Be Aware.
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Going a bit off-topic here, but what I meant isn't that anyone would try to disarm you. Just like your sense of security can be threatened, so can everyone elses.
Say you flick up your tactical knife and you end up at gun point, that's what I was getting at. Personally I would never deploy my knife until I'm in the zone to land a drawstroke which eliminates or atleast partially does so the risk factor of a bad scenario boiling up.
How can you say that you would cut another person for trying to disarm you? In the first place it was your fault for bringing the knife to a public place, and in the court you will be the one taking the heat.
That doesn't sound like avoiding damage or unnecessary drawing blood, it rather sounds like an armed man cutting down an unarmed man.
There's waaaay too many people carrying knives and guns these days. Just hook the offender to the temple or elbow him in the chin or throw a kick in his nads or poke his eyes and then run. Sure he might walk like a bow-legged catterpillar for a while but you saved him and yourself from serious damage.
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If I am at Dave's Famous BBQ with family/friends,eating my steak combo meal, and some random guy comes up and grabs the father's steak knife from his hand or off the table,puts it to somebody's throat,you would not use your EDC as a weapon if necessary???If not...then stop f-ing talking 2 me.What do you do?If an LEO or mil.-umaybUe different...A knife is a tool 99 percent,for most.Where did U serve?Now when somebody has me gun point....I AM NO LONGER %RESPONSIBLE 4 THe ACTIONS tHAT HAPPEN AFTER THAT!U should read what U said.-up your tac.knife...&end upatgunpoint...i am on the same side as u! may ouir opinions differ.If you Dannytanner the situation,and make no action,people will die!!I mean NO disrespect.
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I suppose I don't have any military or police credentials. Been educated about knife and gun defence and "offenders mentality" since I was a scrub in the dojo however. Spent most of my life jumping from styles every 3-4 years. Prefers sparring with individual style blackbelts since I want to be rounded in all aspects, a black belt in Jiu-jitsu, one in Sanshu, one in Taekwondo, even wrestlers, as many "levels" as possible where a fight can go.
But credentials, nope, I never graduate for belts and am thus white belt in all arts except Judo which I graded to green when I was 12 years old, after that I realized how little meaning there were to a colored belt, instead I buy gifts to the dojo like medical supplies, new practice weapons or make a knife for my Sensei.
If that scenario were to happen, my first reaction would ofcourse be to help the person in need. I would try to bring the situation down and talk to the offender to gauge the situation. If it's a rabid dog off his meds then it gets tricky. The last thing I would do is bring out my own weapon, doing so only makes it worse for the person being held up.
Since we assume the hostage has no training in knife and gun defence (there are very effective ways to protect against someone putting a knife to your throat from behind, and follow up with a punish stab to the liver).
Also, calm down buddy, you're obviously very young but you're still having the same lethal weapons as I and everyone else does. I'm not trying to pose or talk junk here, in my eyes you're a potential risk with the attitude you have and I want you to see that there are better solutions than sheer brute force. Or at least save that for when there are no hostages involved.
As I said previously, I never deploy until the moment I strike. What purpose is there to waving around weapons? Absolutely none, it doesn't add anything but more tension, and since you included a hostage in the situation. Well do you get what I mean? It's like flipping up a balisong and playing around with it in front of someone, I mean what point is there to it? The samurai had a very smart saying where they only unsheathed their swords when they knew there was blood about to be spilled.
I also favor the factor of surprise, a drawcut is actually faster than a normal cut because you use more and bigger muscle groups in the hips and triceps instead of the traditional slash or stab which mainly relies on arm force alone.
My way of solving such a situation would be talk the atmosphere down, establish a verbal contact with the offender and try everything I can to get him to release the hostage, after that I would head straight into a fight, tie him up and wait for the officials to come bring him away, maybe take an arm or a leg with me because of the crap he just pulled.
But still, a smart criminal would keep his established hold and don't wave the knife around, he would keep it firmly seated right under the hostages neck. If I saw that kind of glow in the criminal I would tell someone to call the cops immediately and try to slow things down because there's no way to get out of it with no bloodshed unless the hostage knows how to protect against a knife.
It reminds me of a situation that happened to me last night, a drunk has passed out outside my house. I tied his arm under my left knee and took an over-under hold on his other hand. Apparantly he had several arms on him and started to struggle, it was -so- close that I dropped down for an armbar since I had his main hand in the opening move for it.
So he calmed down and I ended up walking him home and apologizing about keeping him tied up and putting pressure on his joints. I told him he shouldn't bring weapons to public places too and that I was very close to breaking his arm.
Stay safe Jeremi. You're always in charge of your own actions, if you're not then I suggest you practice until you are.
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The psycho just put a steak knife to YOUR father's throat!I am not a certified negotiator like you must have been in the past.Yes-violence is the last resort,but using force as you above demonstrated with drunko,can get results asap.I am younger and less experienced than a guy training with masters and mma fighters,I don't disagree with most your reply,but I will do anything for family.I am not eager to stab any person or animal and for you to think I am just as unsafe as the guy on pcp/meth holding a knife to your DADDy's main vain is ignorant.
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There is a world's difference between a junked out addict compared to you my friend, but the 'aggressive' way you wrote earlier gave me the impression that you act on feelings much if not entirely. That itself is a situation waiting to happen, I deal with this every day. Reducing risks, not looking like a victim, being aware and being in control of the situation no matter what happens.
I treat each and every person the same, no matter if it's my mother or a complete stranger, they both have the same right to live and I since I can help them I will, because I would like the same for me if I were to be in the same situation.
Why is my family the world's most important people? There's six billion here on the earth and they all have family. I have meditated for years on this matter and have taken a buddhistic standing that everyone is equal when it comes to this.
Call me cold or ignorant, when it all comes down to it, a life is a life, no matter how small or big it is.
But yeah, if we play along with this imaginary scenario and my own father had a knife to his throat, I would most likely yell at him to grab his knife hand and HOLD on for dear life. Then I would make the process short and cut off the offenders consciousness, take out a few chosen tendons and bones in his arms so he can't use them for a few months because of the shit he tried to pull and say it was a struggle to the police.
The punishment for that move is to "sneak out the back" while you have the knife secured in a reinforced lock. From there you can stab in the liver and then spin around to break his hand then break his elbow with an elbow smash, and then drop down to unsocket his shoulder and make mashed potatoes of his bones, or simply head for a standing triangle and end it all right there, he will be out in less than 5 secs if you do it properly. From there you can keep transferring to leg control while you establish a grip on the other hand or simply spin around the back for the other hand, or if you get a good hold of his foot while you're keeping him down you have a leg lock, then transfer to a foot lock, transfer to a crucifix or electric chair. You can keep piling up damage that would have the guy in hospital for years afterwards.
I applaud you for wanting to help in such a situation (boy we've gone off-topic here lol), few would place them in harms way to protect another human, but humanity itself needs more people like that.
You seem like a good kid man, I like your strong spirit and I wasn't very different myself when I was 18 or so.
I hope nothing like this happens, but you need to see how fragile the situation is. The offender is the one holding all the strings since he has his knife in a vital spot a mere second away from finishing it all off. To stay cool, look around what you can use in your favor and simply talk with the man holding the knife to check how severe the situation is.
You can tell the mood of the offender by simply asking what he wants, depending on how he answers you can draw a conclusion if it's extreme risk or that he's just insecure and aren't really intending or wanting to hurt anyone.
If he releases his throat grip with his knife and starts to wave it around instead that's when you get your chance because that's not a smart criminal and it's time to punish him thoroughly.
You don't need any hostage negotiation education for that. Simple experience and training will be more than enough, what is important is to put yourself in the offenders shoes so you can read his moves before he does them (i.e slits the throat). When you take that step to put a knife to someones throat you not only devote yourself to the situation but also seriously limit your options at the same time.
I can recommend a few styles for you that specializes in modern street defence that works very well and basically all of them go through hostage scenarios like this one.
I've seriously gone off-topic here but in any case, what I meant to tell you Jeremy is that such situation requires a calm and calculated mind, not one in a bloodrage state. For the eventual time when such a situation presents itself to you, please keep it in mind, that's all I wish. Stay safe my friend and always protect yourself. :) (oh, don't forget to practice some armbars and stuff on passed out drunks you find lying around haha, they're great practice material!)
Personally I have always favored bar stools or chairs over knives (pool cues, hot sauce, pepper shaker, salt shaker and so on, just drop or springkle it on your fingers and slap him across the eyes, legal pepperspray basically and no need to get messy with knives). Longer reach and you can keep jabbing him in the head with it while he can't land anything or he gets knocked out ;D
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Off topic indeed,but the things you just stated all hold true for myself.I am glad we could relate better.I did get snappy but it is a touchy subject at times.You are older and wiser,and I respect your thoughts.
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Many thanks Jeremy, it's an extremely 'hard' subject to discuss as it involves so many emotions and sometimes even conflicting emotions.
I speak so freely about my feelings since I have gone through scenarios in the dojo and then meditated over them afterwards.
I came off as a bit of a hardass too in the start but I'm glad we could both end it at the same page. Stay safe and aware, I wish you the best and that none of us stumble upon those crackpots that pulls knives or guns on you :)
You don't live near Florida or the Bronx in NY by the way? There are two dojos that practices my favorite art right now, especially the dojo in the Bronx. The man in charge of that one is... Well it's almost unexplainable, you simply have to experience it for yourself. He taught me more about myself in one day of practicing and teaching than I did in years.
It's a family-grounded style so it has passed through 2 generations and been polished quite darn well for the roughest places in earth, like bronx and so on.
If you're interested contact me in PM and I'll gladly help you find a dojo in this style (it's worth joining just to eventually meet the founder I talked about just now lol)
It's Jiu-jitsu but with more styles mixed in, basically making it combat Jiu-jitsu. It's Judo, Wrestling, Boxing, Taekwondo and Jiu-jitsu forged together.
Personally I'm mixing in more styles that I have experience with in the past though, like Muay Thai, Sanshu and FMA (Filipino martial arts).
Well, now I'm off to polish up a knife I'm making for my mother with arthritis, I've been researching a handle that will work with her disease and it's much more work than I thought.
Have a great time buddy, hope we share some more lines again sometime :)
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I would be very interested to see what the arthritis handle knife looks like.I know a couple family members that have arthritis and I have thought what handle style and blade geometry may work easier,for general kitchen uses,of course. I like your varied learning styles/arts,as it is something the late great Master Bruce Lee emphasized greatly and I feel is part of the way I live.Thanks for being one of what I call "unofficial Homeland Security" we need more people to take action in our society.
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Haha, well I am no expert and I have a long way to go until I reach the height of my master (that crazy dude is 4-dan blackbelt in Jiu-Jiutsu, 2-dan in Judo, 3-dan in Taekwondo. For every art he went to the actual country and practiced with masters we probably never will hear word of.
And then on top of it, his father, the founder of the art I'm studying now walks around a fight with my Sensei like he's tossing a kid around. And even with my Sensei being double-jointed he locks everything up picture-perfect, it's really like art, a true sight to behold - especially when you know just how good your own Sensei is and how ridiculously strong his father must be (the deceptive thing is that he looks completely like a kind old man, I would hate to be the mugger that targeted him lol).
Personally I started with wrestling, but as I started at an age of 6 and then implemented a "grown up" training schedule with practice 3 times a week with competitions saturday and sunday, by the age of 11-12 I had had enough. I had advanced away from the people in my age and was instead pitted against teens and grown-ups, it all became too much for me and I switched to Karate instead. That's when I noticed the lack of finishing moves wrestling had (even though I tied my opponents in the street up and had them hollering in pain, it was still just a pain-submission. With enough heart you can get through that.
Then after a few years I went to Muay Thai, then Sanshu and after that I was set on the MMA aspect and really started to see how I can exploit opponents that only practice one style.
Again I have to really extend my utmost thanks that you became friendlier with me mid-discussion. Now you seem like a much more calm and collected individual to me :)
As I said previously too, I applaud you for having what it takes to stand up against an offender. That's the WORST thing that can happen for a criminal from his point of view, so I say give him hell!
About the arthritis handle, yeah it's a real pain to get them to work properly. It depends on what fingers are most affected, how worn down the joints are and a ton of things.
My mother has had her thumb stiff-operated or whatever it's called in English, so the first thing I did to this handle was to mark the exact locations where her thumb rests on the knife (she has no control over it so she can't put it on the spine).
Since people with arthritis can't depend on their own grip, they need the knife to help them. So all shapes like a bend at the end that secures the handle so it doesn't slip, a thin handle contoured for each finger and so on all helps.
I was actually in on making a sabre-type handle first lol, a solid wood "block" that I would hollow out and make so she could insert her fingers and use her arms instead of her hand, but she said she lost the fine control with that, it basically looked like an 18th century sabre design with a guard for the end, except it was completely closed.
This is my latest "prototype" so to say, but if you want to try and tackle this issue together just give me a holler, I'll gladly share whatever I have with you :)
Sorry everyone for having gone off-topic in this thread. I'm glad I did though because I met this nice guy named Jeremy :)
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