Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on September 16, 2013 at 9:52

OK officially I am congratulating you on the order but secretly wishing it were me!  Now I am surprised you went with the 4000 and really surprised at the 8000!

Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on September 16, 2013 at 10:03

Here is what I remembered about Jack's discussion: "But if I ever get more water stones I'll get the Shapton glass.  For a two stone set I'd get the 500 and 2k grits." So my thinking up to now is those two stones to start. Now you are in a little different direction? Looking for a better or more refined finish?

Permalink Reply by Jack Haskins, Jr. on September 16, 2013 at 10:12

Excellent excellent excellent selection.  I'm glad you got the 8k stone now. I understand you can stand to miss a few meals anyway. lol  Just kidding. :)  It will prove to be worth it I promise you.  In fact I ordered one myself a few days ago.  I got it off ebay though and the arrival date is estimated sometime next month.  I'm hoping this date is so far in the future just to cover the seller's butt.  It is coming from Japan though.  Till now I've been using my 1"x6" 8k stone for the Edge Pro and I am loving that I'm going to have a bench stone (sometime lol).  

I'm thinking you got the least expensive stone holder on CKTG.  If so you have a great one coming.  If so I have it and it works perfectly.  I really can't understand paying what the others cost. They can't hold a stone any more securely than the one I have does.   It's like stone flattening diamond stones.  You can spend between $30 and $300 for one.  I have the $30 stone flattening stone.  Maybe if the other holders will hold longer stones I guess they are worth more money.  The max mine will hold is 8" but that's the biggest I have or will have probably.

Your opinions are expected soon as well as pictures.  I know I know.  We all know what stones look like and your 3 will look like triplets in the pics (unless you take pictures of the bottom). :)  But as I understand it you won't really own the stones AND CAN'T USE THEM until you post pictures. LOL

CONGRATULATIONS!

Jack

Permalink Reply by Jack Haskins, Jr. on September 16, 2013 at 10:47

You are correct Steve.  The 500 and 2k is a perfect set for a knife IMO but that's really if you don't already have other stones.  If you already have a coarser stone for serious steel removal or re-profiling the 500 Shapton glass is not needed and really more expensive a stone than needed just for fast steel removal.  The 2k will give a super great, average grit edge for pocket knives.  But if the edge is pretty dull but not rediculously dull the 2k can bring it back with a bit of work.  Once you hit the 4k stone you are delving into the "better or sharper than needed" area pertaining to pocket knives or standard kitchen knives IMO.  Then the 8k stone is the true beginning of REAL "razor sharp".  I've used the term "razor sharp" many times when talking about knives but truthfully "razor sharp" is only a dream in the knife world.  With a few exceptions of course.  I've jumpted into the straight razor sharpening world just recently.  While I've been wanting the 8k Shapton glass bench stone for quite a while, straight razor shaving prompted me to go ahead and take the plunge. I never know.  I may be looking at the 16k in the future (BUT I HOPE NOT LOL).

I'm happy Stephen went with the selection he did because coarser grits are doable with about any type stones but for the higher grits a higher quality stone seems to be required.  There seem to be a lot of these to choose from also and Shapton glass in in this group.  I'm sitting here very excited about Stephen's purchas and eager to hear what he thinks of them.  I'm conviced the report will be a favorable one.

Stephen, just a word.  I don't know how high of a grit stone you have experienced so this may be a factor.  The higher grit stones produce a very smooth edge/bevel and with this level of perfection you may (or may not) need to improve your edge angle accuracy.  I say this because years ago I could get a real good edge using my 20 year old medium grit Arkansas stone but would then dull the edge if I tried to refine it on my fine grit.  I finally gave up using the fine grit stone.  Now I could be using it as my ability is better and I can control the angle better.  Just in case you experience anything like this just know it's temporary and it won't be long before your are getting your knives sharper than ever before with super smoother edges (not toothy) and mirror finish bevels.

Jack

Jack

Steve Hanner said:

Here is what I remembered about Jack's discussion: "But if I ever get more water stones I'll get the Shapton glass.  For a two stone set I'd get the 500 and 2k grits." So my thinking up to now is those two stones to start. Now you are in a little different direction? Looking for a better or more refined finish?

Permalink Reply by Stephen L. Corley on September 16, 2013 at 12:37

Steve and Jack, thanks for the good words. I, too, am looking at the straight razor shaving. I figure before I spend the $200 on a straight razor, I had better be able to maintain the edge. My plan is to practice first on the Mora. After that I will go to pocket knives.

I believe I have said before, I got into convex edges about a year and a half ago. In that time I have not honed much at all. So over the past month or 2, I have been practicing with my Ark. stones. The first thing I noticed was, I developed the habit of rolling my hand when honing. I have been working on that with pocket knives and my Mora. One thing about a scandi grid, it will show if you are not maintaining a steady stroke. The ink doesn't lie.

I have not made up my mind on the finer grit Shaptons. I enjoy stropping and will have to see how it goes. I'll get some picks and maybe a video. I can't promise on the video.

Have a good day my friends.

Permalink Reply by Steve Hanner on September 16, 2013 at 12:38

OK got it that time and I agree can't wait for Stephen to get his and see what happens. Controlling angle is huge I think though and other than practice I don't see any other way to guarantee success?

In MemoriamPermalink Reply by Robert Burris on September 16, 2013 at 12:52

Let me say first I am a believer in water stones. Even a blade that is kept sharp, and is used regularly will need to be re-profiled once in a while. I to would love to hear the review, on these fine stones.

Permalink Reply by Jack Haskins, Jr. on September 16, 2013 at 13:00

Stropping.  A VERY interesting subject.  Over the past few years I've gone through different opinions on it.  With the higher grit stones a good technique you can get a knife edge sharper than than an average grit stone and average skill using stones AND strops.  For a while I HAD to use a strop to get what I called a screaming edge. Now I can get what I used to call a screaming edge with only stones.  Good stones.  That being said proper stropping on quality strops with quality compounds should take the edge even farther (sharper).  This can be a long converstation so I'll stop with this.  Anyone who has a 2k, 4k and 8k Shapton glass stones has the tools needed to create amazing edges.  Maybe not like a straight razor that is properly honed but plenty to shave your face with just to say you once did it. :)  lol  Good luck.

Having said this and reading it it looks like I may think I know everything.  I don't.  I know some and am still learning.  It's great fun to hit the next level of improvement and I do this even after I get to one level after another.  I have many levels yet to hit. Still fun too.

Stropping is great and like using stones requires it's own technique to get the benefits strops are capable of giving.  Another area that seems can always be improved yet never mastered. lol

Jack

Stephen L. Corley said:

Steve and Jack, thanks for the good words. I, too, am looking at the straight razor shaving. I figure before I spend the $200 on a straight razor, I had better be able to maintain the edge. My plan is to practice first on the Mora. After that I will go to pocket knives.

I believe I have said before, I got into convex edges about a year and a half ago. In that time I have not honed much at all. So over the past month or 2, I have been practicing with my Ark. stones. The first thing I noticed was, I developed the habit of rolling my hand when honing. I have been working on that with pocket knives and my Mora. One thing about a scandi grid, it will show if you are not maintaining a steady stroke. The ink doesn't lie.

I have not made up my mind on the finer grit Shaptons. I enjoy stropping and will have to see how it goes. I'll get some picks and maybe a video. I can't promise on the video.

Have a good day my friends.

Permalink Reply by Jan Carter on September 17, 2013 at 4:57

This is a great discussion and for those of us that are "sharpening challenged"  it is extremely useful.  I tend to take the easy way out and hand my knives to Donnie to sharpen.  With limited skills to begin with, not utilizing the skill leads to bad habits as Stephen said. I am happy to know I am not the only one that gets those bad habits though LOL

I am truly interested in a review on these Stephen and also following the progress of your new shaving adventure

Permalink Reply by Jack Haskins, Jr. on September 17, 2013 at 7:14

Another thing to consider is Stephen will have stones that will easily sharpen any blade steel on the market.  Blade steels that are hard to sharpen because they are harder will not stand a chance when they come up against the Shapton glass stones.  I got a Queen recently with PH-D2 blade steel.  I really like this steel because the edge retention is better than a lot of other steels.  It does take a little longer to sharpen because it is a little harder.  Of course this is why the edge will stay sharper for a little longer.  Then there are steels that are MUCH harder.  They are more difficult to sharpen but they will stay sharp and usable for a much longer period of time between touch ups.  The hardest steel I own is ZDP-189 with an Rc of 64-66.  This hardness is borderline too hard.  Any harder and the steel will chip very easily on the edge where the steel is so thin.  But, the Shapton glass stones sharpen this steel perfectly fine.  It requires more strokes than PH-D2 or 440C and many others so that means more time.  But this extra time spent sharpening can be justified by the knife staying sharp for a much longer period of time (depending on it's use).

Permalink Reply by Stephen L. Corley on September 18, 2013 at 10:00

They arrived! I have to say, I'm very impressed with the promptness of their shipping. Here is how it went. All orders over $60 ship free. All orders over 2lbs ship FedEx. So, I got both the free shipping and FedEx delivery. Madison, Wi. to Jackson Ms. in 2 days. I placed my order Monday morning. They sent me an email confirming the order immediately, which is not unusual. I received an email Monday afternoon informing me that they had shipped my order. Tuesday, I received an email from FedEx giving me a tracking number for my order. At a little after 9am this Wednesday morning, I received my order.

When my son gets home, I'll have him get his camera out and take some pics. If I'm not a complete retard, I'll post them this evening. In the event that I am a complete retard, well, you know. lol

Now, it's time to give them a try.

Permalink Reply by Stephen L. Corley on September 18, 2013 at 10:48

I have given them a try and the only thing wrong with them is my own imperfections in honing. Here is a little info I discovered. I didn't state this earlier, but they are white. Being ceramic, they do not absorb water. The water simply sits on top. Before use it tends to puddle. After a few strokes the water began to spread out evenly. The water quickly turns black from metal contamination. They remove metal quickly. After using, I washed them in cool water as the instruction recommended. They did not come out completely clean. There is still some black on them from metal getting caught in the grit is my guess. Do not dry them off with a towel! You will have lint all over them. With a little time and patience, I will "hone" my skill and they will do exactly what I am wanting.

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