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The File & Wire Tested Legacy

Everyone seems to want to get into more history which is great for me because there is a lot of aspects that can be discussed. So I thought maybe I could have a new Queen History Topic each week and that way we can have time to discuss.

Well I will be the first one to admit that I only knew bits and pieces of the File & Wire Tested story. So I decided to call David Clark, Queen Cutlery Co, Historian. Sadly he told me that no one has ever really been able to pin point for exact where this old school process came from or how it became a selling point for the Schatt & Morgan line. However we do know that it was developed at least back when they still were in Gowanda, NY. (please see box label below)

First, for those have no idea what I'm talking about I will get into the main story that more people know about. Well back in the day before Rockwell hardness testing equipment they tested blades by using variety of materials such as stones and files that had a certified hardness. The ability of the item to scratch the blade would allowed them to measure the hardness of it.

So Schatt & Morgan obviously developed their own version of the test where they would use the blade to cut into a file then test it by cutting a wire of known consistency and hardness. Schatt & Morgan were able to develop that proven test into a catchy slogan that become there back bone or their trademark.

Know I would like to get some input on this story and really would like to find the origin even though I'm not holding my breath. If I have misinterpreted something please commit so we might be able to find some new information out.

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Ray Ludlam on July 2, 2013 at 14:22

I had no idea that they would cut INTO a file. That had to leave a mark. I sure like the old time catalog photo.

KnifeMakerPermalink Reply by Dave Taylor on July 2, 2013 at 15:27

The file and wire method of testing the hardness and temper of a blade can be quite accurate with a bit of experience on the part of the tester. It is used in part by members of the American Bladesmith Society today.

When the blade is hardened "just right" it can be cut with a new file, but an old and well used file will slide off the blade surface without cutting. This is a test of hardness. However, at this level of hardness the blade is brittle and needs to be tempered by drawing down some of that hardness.

Cutting a wire of known hardness without the edge of the blade "rolling", chipping or deforming shows the proper tempering level of the blade. The two tests together prove the blade is now heat treated properly and will give long and satisfactory performance upon which reputations can be built.

The old time blade forgers went by the color of the heated steel to determine proper temperature before quenching the blade to harden it and then again when reheating it after cooling to draw the temper. Sometimes a copper plate was used for tempering because the copper gave an even temperature especially when tempering a larger blade. The blade was laid on the heated copper plate and allowed to absorb that heat before it was again cooled and ready for testing and finishing.

Schatt & Morgan made good use of this old time blade testing system in their advertising. Perhaps this is why the File & Wire Tested series of Schatt & Morgan knives have used some of the best cutlery steels in their relatively recent production runs. I personally appreciate the ATS-34 steel in the blades of the S. & M. File & Wire knife that rides in my pocket everyday and I look forward to this continuing in future series productions. D-2 is another personal favorite of mine.

Even though we have more scientific methods of testing heat treatment of blades these days "File & Wire Tested" meant something in vintage Schatt & Morgan knives.

In MemoriamPermalink Reply by Robert Burris on July 2, 2013 at 16:28

A good explanation, Dave. We forget, some times, that our fore fathers didn't have all of the new gadgets to find out when a product was made correctly, or incorrectly.

KnifeMakerPermalink Reply by Dave Taylor on July 2, 2013 at 16:37

Okay, so what kind of "wire" was cut by this new blade to prove proper temper? I honestly don't have the true answer to that, but after thinking on it a bit in the company of a pint Mason jar of "Lynchburg Lemonade" and using a little horse sense and reasoning, both of which are admittedly arguable, I consider the following:

I would think that iron wire, such as what we used to call stove pipe wire, might be too hard and would tend to roll or deform the tempered edge of the new blade. Copper wire would be soft enough to be easily cut by a relatively "soft" tempered blade, and so would not make a good "test".

But what about all the wire that was lying about all around the factory? The brass wire that was, and still is, used for the pins in the pocketknife? It is soft enough to be peened into a good rivet yet hard enough to hold and last. Would not this common brass wire be about the right consistency to be a good test if cut by a new and properly tempered blade?

I do not have a vintage File & Wire Tested knife to try this theory, so it is merely speculation on my part, but it kind of makes sense to me. What do you think?

FeaturedPermalink Reply by Craig Henry on July 2, 2013 at 17:19

Sounds logical to me. Too bad the old companies didn't document stuff more.

KnifeMakerPermalink Reply by Dave Taylor on July 3, 2013 at 12:57

Now I have even more information on the blade tempering method used by Schatt & Morgan, taken from the 1907 Schatt & Morgan catalog recently received from my friend Mr. David Clark. Natural gas, a by product of the numerous oil wells in the area, was used by Schatt & Morgan for blade tempering. Here is what the 1907 catalog has to say:

Tempering Department: "The original method of tempering was on a copper plate. Then the operator's eye was the whole thing. If his eyesight was poor one day, that was the day we had poor blades. With our modern gas tempering furnace, that is all changed. The blades are submerged into hot oil, the furnace sealed, and heated to a certain degree of temperature, and the work is done, every blade is of the same degree of hardness, the same today, tomorrow, or at any time. One reason we can GUARANTEE UNCONDITIONALLY - because we know they are right."

However, even a perfectly tempered blade can still be ruined by overheating it during the grinding process. Here is what the 1907 catalog has to say about that.

Grinding Department: "Here is where all blades in our knives are ground. We say without hesitation this is the finest grinding room in America. Perfect light, perfect ventilation, grinding troughs of our own design and make, insuring absolute safety for our workmen. Surrounded by the most perfect arrangements we are enabled to secure the most skilled workmen in the trade, consequently, our blades are always properly ground, and never burned in this operation. Another reason why we can GUARANTEE UNCONDITIONALLY - we know they are right."

These 1903 and 1907 Schatt & Morgan catalog reprints from Mr. Clark are wonderful reference books for anyone interested in Schatt & Morgan knives, or pocketknife history in general. They are a valuable addition to my library!

Permalink Reply by Ron Cooper on July 3, 2013 at 21:43

Dave,

I previously had a rather limited, cursory understanding of the File & Wire series of knives and the methods used for testing. Your recent posts have help to shed considerable light on the subject and I appreciate your efforts immensely! Thank you for your valuable contributions on this subject.

Cheers, my friend!

KnifeMakerPermalink Reply by Dave Taylor on July 3, 2013 at 21:55

Thank you kindly Ron. I am glad my contributions are of interest. Fun doing the research.

Permalink Reply by Jan Carter on July 4, 2013 at 11:52

OK, I didnt have the slightest idea of any of this. I appreciate your venturing into the newest part of the library and helping us to understand. Now pass the lemonaid and continue please

KnifeMakerPermalink Reply by Dave Taylor on July 4, 2013 at 11:57

Everyone is most welcome to drop by for some Lynchburg Lemonade anytime.

BYOJ (Bring Your Own Jar).

We will talk knives!

Permalink Reply by Indian on July 4, 2013 at 18:36