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A Pakistan suppliers point of view...didn't see that coming did you?

I was recently contacted by a supplier of Pakistan knives and steel. Now, Now...give this discussion a chance.

This supplier has been on iKC for a number of years. When he first contacted me it was with the hope that I would listen and have an open minded discussion with him. Because he is a member and has been very respectful not to overstep here at iKC with selling openly. I chose to listen. This was how the discussion started

The issue is that I want to directly market my knives in USA market, these have already been sold in large quantity but indirectly by my country men, both in retail and wholesale. But I am sick and tired by their behavior of exploiting the smooth running business contact by dishonesty in many ways.

Well, that intrigued me & I decided to be brutally honest. My reply was that you face 2 challenges. Poor steel reputation from the region and the working environment (as we know it). A few more emails passed regarding the environment of the workers. We came to understand that he himself is not a maker, but has many local makers producing for him. He interviews makers before he begins to accept their work and checks out their product. My next question? Do you employ kids? The answer, yes. It is a fact of the economic life in that region that children work within the family. Much the same as it was for us many, many moons ago. What did I find different enough to continue listening after that statement? He discusses with the family before hiring a young worker that he wants them them to get an education also.

So my next discussion with him focused solely on quality, not of the build but of the steel. I asked him to read a current discussion on here http://www.iknifecollector.com/forum/topics/does-anybody-want-this-.... I have been pretty brutally honest with my answers to him. I advised him to give a few of his knives to people that use them hard and have them reviewed. I also advised that he needed to be prepared for the response about the knives be that whatever it may be!

Lat me start by making this clear. I do not intend to sell Pakistan knives, nor will I allow soliciting on the site. As an international community I am curious.

So here is my question. If you knew a company stood behind their product, that you were dealing with the company owner. Would YOU be willing to buy a knife made in Pakistan?

Tags: Forum, Knife, Pakistan

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Comment by Steve Scheuerman (Manx) on July 20, 2014 at 18:15: I agree with John in this. Every country has their junk makers and rip off artists. A "Made in USA" stamp does not make a knife awesome or great. :-) This fallacy of USA or it's junk has been more of a detriment to the knife industry than anything else I have seen. There are some incredible pieces coming out all over the world, but the prevalent attitude is if it don't come from the States, then it's no good. I sure beg to differ. The East has been playing with steel for a heck of a lot longer than us kids in the West. Like...thousands of years more. To assume the attitude of "Ours are best" is a pretty arrogant leap, in my eyes. Would I buy a knife from Pakistan? Heck yes...with all the same requirements I would have buying from a Western maker or supplier. Good workmanship, good materials and solid business practices. No different than what I would expect from here. Waqas, I would love to see some of your stuff and check it out. I have no issues at all trying out a Pakistan knife, and would welcome the chance to try one out, or add some to my collection! It's kinda funny to hear folks talk about helping the knife industry grow and supporting makers etc...then hearing the same people clam right up at the mention of a foreign made knife, and refuse to buy one or support makers just because it's from a different country. I say...judge by quality, not assumption. They may have more junk makers than here, but think a second...they also have 4 times the population we have, or more. Of course there will be more....and with today's attitude of me, me, me, there will be more and more rip off artists from all over the world.

I may be a knife snob...but I am *NOT* a knife racist! ;-) Bring on the good stuff! We teach our kids tolerance when dealing with people...why stop there? Knives are peop...err...nevermind. Got carried away! LOL

In Memoriam Comment by John McCain on July 20, 2014 at 16:23: BTW, here is a link to Muhammad Azeem's knife photos- Hardly junk, beautiful, yes !!http://www.iknifecollector.com/photo/photo/listForContributor?scree...

In Memoriam Comment by John McCain on July 20, 2014 at 16:06: I have seen "junk" Pakistani knives and I have seen the exact opposite- My friend,Muhammad Azeem is an IKC member and knifemaker- Look at his knives and you will see exceptional quality- I would be proud to own one of his knives- Name any other knife producing country and you will find both crap and artistry- Germany, Britain, Japan, and even the USA-Country of origin does not always make a bad knife, but peoples perceptions do- Ever buy a knife cuz its Solingen, Germany or Sheffield, England?? They had junk makers, too !!-Just my 2 cents~~~USA has had their share,too--

Comment by Gus Marsh on July 20, 2014 at 15:36: His name was Danio Knives Pakistan, here is his web site: http://danioknives.com/

Comment by Gus Marsh on July 20, 2014 at 15:30: There was a guy at the last Knife Expo 2014 from Pakistan, he had a table on my same row and did good very good business, let me see if I can find out his name or business name.

Comment by Jan Carter on July 20, 2014 at 15:21: Thank you for correcting that Waqas. I am also interested in why the same product is getting a higher price if sold by non pakistani company. If the buyer is aware of the origin, why would a non Pakistan seller get more?

I cannot say how pleased I am that you have chosen to have this discussion with us. It is an honor that you would think enough of our community and it's members to value the input.

KnifeMaker Comment by Waqas Yousaf Farooq on July 20, 2014 at 15:07: Let me do one correction on my typing mistake, I wanted to mention that why that Non Pakistani gets higher price, I wrongly stated "Less Price"

KnifeMaker Comment by Waqas Yousaf Farooq on July 20, 2014 at 15:03: I am very lucky because of having a chance to present myself among a heavy mob of experienced people. I have gone through this discussion. And analyzed the view points of respected members. What I would say that all the concerns regarding product quality and business ethics can only be justified by practice. I can not convince anybody by my words but only and only b my work and attitude, especially when there is mostly a negative perception.

One thing that really make me to think a lot that what it should be called and I am anxious to hear any logical answer on it. Knives with same attributes , finished in my work shop but sold by two different sellers, one is Pakistani and other one is American or non Pakistani . why the Non Pakistani gets less price than other one on 100% same product ? There are many American knife makers and sellers getting finished and semi finished knives or steel from here by stamping there logos on blades. And selling this stuff on high prices successfully while their customers also know about the region of those knives !!!!

I totally disagree with this argument regarding the quality of product that its good or bad due to origin of make, because quality is defined by customer, if any one is not providing the demanded attributes in a product or service than he gets out from the game naturally. Especially in a highly competitive environment.

I am ready and willing to put my work in front of any one who can give me honest feed back.

Actions must speak louder than words !!!!

Comment by John Bamford on July 20, 2014 at 2:02: I would buy a knife from anywhere if I thought it was made with passion and integrity . I would want good quality steel and to feel that the deal was honest and above board , In the UK there is a big market for clothes made in Pakistan and we know that the working conditions are not good , I would not buy a knife made in those conditions.

Having said that the working conditions in Sheffield ,in the heyday of knife making, were not good but they still turned out good knives.

Comment by Ms Data on July 19, 2014 at 20:08: There is a high probability that I would not buy a knife made in Pakistan. I can't say 100% no, but it would have to be a very unusual knife under very unusual circumstances to get me to buy it.